KC74
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everyone on this thread or not on this thread should cheer up!!
Oct 13, 2011,03:08 AM
..intrinsic value is defined differently by everyone. I personally seriously dont want to spend too much time thinking about at what level of intrinsic value each of my watches achieve, that is some bollock story that i tell myself and comfort myself, LOL. Just wear our watches with fun, happiness, joy, sharing with your friends like how Thomas and Arthur did .. chill guys, life is more than just intrinsic value or market value or i pay this much and when i sell i get such returns multiplied a 100 times..thats a bit of a tale, well of course we saw that happening, because the other side who pays a 100 times more than what seller willing to let go, saw much more "intrinsic value". Anyways, hope everyone is chilled and for such fun forum, we should not be apologizing with each other. Many things especially "intrinsic value" which to me, only IMO, is subjective and immeasurable. Intrinsic value can also mean face value and many other meanings.
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What is "Intrinsic Value" of a Watch?
By: ArthurSG : October 9th, 2011-23:56
I will admit it! I don't know what the heck the definition of "intrinsic value" of a watch is and what constitutes "intrinsic value" of a watch. I have read and heard it mentioned by many several times and there seems to be no consistent defintion which b...
" Intrinsic Value "... That is such a subjective topic...
By: amanico : October 10th, 2011-00:19
We have all a different approach of what is an intrinsic value. When it comes to watches, I would say: 1/ Is the watch " well thought "? ( Conception: What is the idea behind the watch? ) 2/ Is the watch well made? ( Finish, presentation, decoration ). 3/...
Thansk for this Nico
By: ArthurSG : October 10th, 2011-07:22
I can align with and fully are agree with your 3 anti-intrinsic value points. On your 5 points of what constitue for you intrinsic value, I can only readily agree with 2 and those having to do with movement and finishing. The rest I fear provide great fod...
This is a superb PuristS question Arthur, and I know exactly why ...
By: AndrewD : October 10th, 2011-04:14
... you are struggling to find the answer. It is because there is no strict definition of intrinsic value when it comes to watches. It is something that only you can define (and quantitate) for yourself. Sure, as collectors we have areas of agreement, but...
Thanks Andrew
By: ArthurSG : October 10th, 2011-07:28
It seems to me that you and Mao are pointing towards intrinsic value as being some kind of premium over market value that an individual will place?
Exactly the opposite of how I use the term...
By: ThomasM : October 10th, 2011-06:48
Hi, I've used intrinsic value in many of my discussions on the "value" of timepieces (in fact, all "collectibles") and gone so far as to define secondary (or "derivative") concepts based on intrinsic value as one of the determining variables. At any given...
Thomas, just from your post here in isolation
By: ArthurSG : October 10th, 2011-07:06
it seems like if we had to tag a monetary value to your definition of intrinsic value, it will be some premium over the market price which as you say is decided by market forces and this is decided solely on the individual buyer through some logic or lack...
I think there's two notions...
By: BDLJ : October 10th, 2011-18:59
...being discussed in parallel here. One is "how to define Intrinsic Value', the other is 'how to measure or scale it'. An irrational hobby trying to be defined by an ambiguous concept? Fraught with problems. It's all in the context.
intrinsic value = market value - price paid
By: xsw : October 11th, 2011-07:59
If its not equal to market price right now, you're making a loss, period. Nothing can change this fact. So the lowest-bound price is the market price anyone can sell it at. This means almost ALL of the watches out there, and OTHER fellow "It-Items"; limit...
"it-item" = buzzword or lingo.
By: ThomasM : October 11th, 2011-09:40
Hi, I understand your point of view on this (I think) your valuation theory is either tautological (it is because I define it that way, so therefore it cannot be disputed) or commodity based, which assumes near-perfect substitutibility, of either the item...
Intrinsic value need not equate to market value
By: dreamer8 : October 10th, 2011-19:17
I will give one example. My recent fascination with vintage Omega Constellation C's. prompted my search and some research. Back in '66, these were sold for USD 1 K and $ 100 more expensive than the Rolex day date. The current market value is about the pri...
Not to be contrary....
By: Ginger : October 10th, 2011-08:47
but "intrinsic value" is usually only discussed when a collector thinks that he has paid or is being asked to pay too much for a collectible item. Perhaps another purchase cannot now be made. Perhaps the collector has sufficient funds for other purchases,...
Thanks Ginger. Your statement
By: ArthurSG : October 10th, 2011-09:11
"Perhaps the collector has sufficient funds for other purchases, but he feels taken advantage of or annoyed" resonates with me unfortunately and while I can and have chosen to just walk away, that it is so rampant in various forms is a big contributor to ...
That's basically it in a nutshell, Arthur. The rub . . .
By: Dr No : October 10th, 2011-11:25
. . . as it applies to vintage is the proliferation of variables to consider. The spread between the market and intrinsic values of a 14060 Submariner is minimal because market conditions are largely transparent. With vintage, it's a completely different ...
they don't and that was my point.
By: ThomasM : October 11th, 2011-02:06
there are some common foundations of intrinsic value - "finishing" (even though the perceived level of finishing could be subjective but also commonly understood, its "value" is entirely personal) for the most part intrinsic value is PERSONAL I think we a...
Some variations on this theme
By: Nomer : October 10th, 2011-14:29
The discussion of course needs to be framed by the definition of "intrinsic" and even perhaps "value" but let's not over complicate things. Here are two core definitions of intrinsic value based on two somewhat varied definitions of "intrinsic": 1. At it'...
Thanks for chiming in Nomer
By: ArthurSG : October 10th, 2011-19:52
Good to know that once in a while I can start a post of some interest. I agree with your point on the auction or transacted price as a good indicator of value BUT I am thinking that intrinsic value is the premium one places over the market value of a watc...
2 ways to look at this
By: 41northpole : October 10th, 2011-14:30
There is the monetary value, basically what someone will pay for it, be it new or second hand. The other value is that vested in it by its owner, be it sentimental or such My 2p Cheers Tim
Intrinsic value applies to many things
By: ling5hk : October 10th, 2011-17:45
Price that you paid (you have doubt whether you paid the right price)=price you perceived subjectively as right price + intrinsic value (this can be anything in any form which can only be subjectively justified by yourself). At the end of the day, you use...
I appreciate all PM's and emails about the misunderstanding.
By: ThomasM : October 11th, 2011-06:25
for those of you who pointed out my poor choice of words and how easily they were misunderstood, thank you, I appreciate the concern, and most especially I appreciate the benefit of the doubt from those of you who do know me and know that I am not one to ...
"intrinsic" does it really mean the lowest price I have to take?
By: cazalea : October 11th, 2011-21:19
or could it be that, as Thomas said, there is an arbitrage situation in play here? When I was in the car value / price guide business, we would say a 2000 Subaru WRX was worth $$ in California, but $$$ in upstate New York. NY has bad weather, snow storms,...
For me the intrinsic value of the watch
By: Massi : October 12th, 2011-20:08
is its production cost, factored in the part of R&D and all machines and whatever you want to add that contribute to its production, but not the costs associated to its marketing. My willingness to pay is my subjective value for that watch.
LOL!
By: ArthurSG : October 13th, 2011-07:14
What fancy terms we assign to simple notions Like, its not an apple we eat, but a creation of god born out of fertile soil, nurtured with the tears of heaven and the light of the universe till its becomes a vivid shade of mercury we call red... It's a dam...
everyone on this thread or not on this thread should cheer up!!
By: KC74 : October 13th, 2011-03:08
..intrinsic value is defined differently by everyone. I personally seriously dont want to spend too much time thinking about at what level of intrinsic value each of my watches achieve, that is some bollock story that i tell myself and comfort myself, LOL...
A vintage perspective
By: Ubik : October 13th, 2011-06:38
I hesitate to add another thought here, so much has been covered and many very lucid points made. My area of interest is in vintage watches and so my comments can only be about those, but maybe I can add some extra concepts to the mix. First, I haven't co...
Thanks for this Ubik. Very insightful.
By: ArthurSG : October 13th, 2011-07:01
It also touches on another thread I started on wanting to learn more about vintages so double benefot for me. Thanks.
The intrinsic value was always there ...
By: AndrewD : October 14th, 2011-20:19
Thanks Ubik, Great addition to the discussion. The intrinsic value in the JLC military watch was always there, it just wasn't recognized widely. As more information becomes available and more people are interested in the watches the monetary value increas...